Have Fresh Off Boat Exiles Start With A Sunpebble

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Should "fresh off the boat" exiles get sunpebbles?

Yes!
33
79%
No! (Reasons why would be appreciated.)
0
No votes
Down with the system - sunstones for all!
7
17%
Better idea - reason below.
2
5%
 
Total votes: 42

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Re: Have Fresh Off Boat Exiles Start With A Sunpebble

Post by Gremlins » Mon Feb 09, 2009 5:07 pm

Maeght wrote:
Lorikeet wrote: To Maeght: It's precisely because of the community interaction that a sunpebble makes a lot of sense.
How are sunpebbles interactive with the community? Maybe I'm missing something but I thought all they did was let you hear /thinks.
That's already a good start no ? How do you get involved if you are actually missing that part ? A lot more than "in" and "east" or "all" happens on the sunstone network… And I would actually tend to provide the whole thing (keep the 2 upgrades as coin sink if you want) to newbies. That seems to work in Arindal (and they break after a while and seem a bit chalenging to get them back, I'd even support that idea eventually)…
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Re: Have Fresh Off Boat Exiles Start With A Sunpebble

Post by xepel » Mon Feb 09, 2009 5:12 pm

Maeght wrote:You are the one advocating a change to the basic game mechanics.
Basic game mechanics?! You are really playing this out as far, *far* more than it is.

It's just a sunpebble. So they can listen to what is going on, and then be curious and ask around town, or whatnot. They are used to them because if they are true newbies they have used an Agratis... and Agratisen have sunpebbles.

We aren't "changing the basic game mechanics." You make it like we're giving away runesticks and oak bashers in TC.
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Re: Have Fresh Off Boat Exiles Start With A Sunpebble

Post by Fogtripper » Mon Feb 09, 2009 5:13 pm

Lorikeet wrote:To Fogtripper: My comment wasn't clear enough sorry. I meant so little gets done, it appeared that this was something that could be done, and since most are in favor (see poll) it made sense to do it.
I'm perfectly fine with overwhelming votes being implemented. That said, just because a vote is overwhelming, doesn't mean I suddenly agree with the idea. I also like to discuss my point of views.
:wink:

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Re: Have Fresh Off Boat Exiles Start With A Sunpebble

Post by Fogtripper » Mon Feb 09, 2009 5:18 pm

Gremlins wrote:Maybe we need a server with just FogTripper and Maeght… Where there will be no free lib, and even getting out of the lib will cost ranks and coins…
You know what Gremlins? Go fuck yourself. I came up with an alternative. Maeght came up with another alternative. People gave hardly a glance and tried to portray us as strict nazi-esque elitists. It's all or nothing with them, with no ability to compromise. Then you waltz in and take a massive shit on the conversation. Most likely having not even read the thread.

Thanks for that.

edit: Also, yeah. Maeght and I are joined at the hip and agree on everything. Yup, that's us. Always in lockstep. Apparently you don't even bother to read more than one thread a year.
Last edited by Fogtripper on Mon Feb 09, 2009 5:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Have Fresh Off Boat Exiles Start With A Sunpebble

Post by Maeght » Mon Feb 09, 2009 5:20 pm

xepel wrote:
Maeght wrote:You are the one advocating a change to the basic game mechanics.
Basic game mechanics?! You are really playing this out as far, *far* more than it is.
Please read the context. He accused me of supporting change: eleminating pay lib, when I in fact oppose change: free sunpebbles. Say what you want, but I insist that at least the basic fact be acknowledged.

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Re: Have Fresh Off Boat Exiles Start With A Sunpebble

Post by Gremlins » Mon Feb 09, 2009 5:29 pm

Fogtripper wrote:
Gremlins wrote:Maybe we need a server with just FogTripper and Maeght… Where there will be no free lib, and even getting out of the lib will cost ranks and coins…
You know what Gremlins? Go fuck yourself..
Yeah. Move it to the appropriate thread then…
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Re: Have Fresh Off Boat Exiles Start With A Sunpebble

Post by noivad » Mon Feb 09, 2009 5:32 pm

Maeght wrote:
xepel wrote:
Maeght wrote:You are the one advocating a change to the basic game mechanics.
Basic game mechanics?! You are really playing this out as far, *far* more than it is.
Please read the context. He accused me of supporting change: eleminating pay lib, when I in fact oppose change: free sunpebbles. Say what you want, but I insist that at least the basic fact be acknowledged.
This isn't a basic game mechanic. Adding SS channels outside the 4 in game would be a basic change. Or changing swing regeneration rate proportionally to match balance total would be one. This is like a sliver of a change in communication ability. It's nothing new, nor is it a fundamental change in the game itself.

So, Maeght an Fog are on record as being opposed to it. That's fine. I don't see the need to go to personal attacks on either side for this issue that's almost a non-issue.
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Re: Have Fresh Off Boat Exiles Start With A Sunpebble

Post by Fogtripper » Mon Feb 09, 2009 5:36 pm

xepel wrote:Basic game mechanics?! You are really playing this out as far, *far* more than it is.
Holy shit Xepel. I would swear it was you making statements like:
xepel wrote:Living in silence in a world where communication is key does *not* hook people.
xepel wrote:They aren't becoming a mystic, you don't have to make things as hard as possible for them. ;p
xepel wrote:Not all struggles are *good* struggles. Some are pointless. Having a sunpebble helps here.
xepel wrote:We can't and shouldn't make things hard just for the sake of making them hard.
xepel wrote: It's delusional to think that we're going to attract people by forcing them to struggle to just *listen* to the main form of communication in the lands.
So according to you Xepel, we want to:
- Make it as difficult as becoming a mystic
- Force them to live in silence (gee, I guess those speech bubbles are worthless)
- Make it hard, just because we want to (even though it's been this way since, well forever)
- Make it "hard as possible". (yeah, that's what our ideas would do)

So, WHO is "playing this out as far, *far* more than it is"? Who is it that resorts to silly extremes that neither Maeght nor I were suggesting?

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Re: Have Fresh Off Boat Exiles Start With A Sunpebble

Post by noivad » Mon Feb 09, 2009 5:39 pm

Fogtripper wrote:Who is it that resorts to silly extremes that neither Maeght nor I were suggesting?
That's just Xepel! :lol:
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Re: Have Fresh Off Boat Exiles Start With A Sunpebble

Post by Gremlins » Mon Feb 09, 2009 5:40 pm

Maeght wrote:
xepel wrote:
Maeght wrote:You are the one advocating a change to the basic game mechanics.
Basic game mechanics?! You are really playing this out as far, *far* more than it is.
Please read the context. He accused me of supporting change: eleminating pay lib, when I in fact oppose change: free sunpebbles. Say what you want, but I insist that at least the basic fact be acknowledged.
I guess I forgot to put a smiley… I could do like someone else and link to some wikipedia article (and yes It wasn't you or FT). The idea there was that you actually used the fact that it was that way for years (like the free lib) to actually oppose to a change that seems reasonable (to me at least). But sure, if nothing can change… Lets remove all the trainers that were implemented after the 3 that existed first (if my memory serves me well for the number). The Agratis demo works well too (after all, it has been working for 10 years). The storage works well. No reason to change it , it has also been working for bloody ages…
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Re: Have Fresh Off Boat Exiles Start With A Sunpebble

Post by Maeght » Mon Feb 09, 2009 5:44 pm

noivad wrote: This isn't a basic game mechanic. Adding SS channels outside the 4 in game would be a basic change. Or changing swing regeneration rate proportionally to match balance total would be one. This is like a sliver of a change in communication ability. It's nothing new, nor is it a fundamental change in the game itself.
.
Do you understand that the game has social mechanics designed in? The sunstone has historically been a milestone for a character, often recognized when the character tests the sunstone for transmission the first time.

It is analogous to building a house in frontier times. You can do it alone, but often the community will help. Once you have it, you're part of the community.

Handing them a listen only device does not make them part of the community. It does not let them participate. "Is anyone with lowbie A?" Lowbie B is and dealing with the situation, but can't answer.

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Re: Have Fresh Off Boat Exiles Start With A Sunpebble

Post by Fogtripper » Mon Feb 09, 2009 5:44 pm

I mean hell, neither Maeght or my ideas were any more of a "struggle", hardship, OMG BECOMING A MYSTIC bullshit than getting a moonstone. Actually it would have been easier, as the NPC would tell you where to get the items.

Heck, even deathknights in WoW have little miniquests right after character creation. In order to get their weapons, mounts and armors.

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Re: Have Fresh Off Boat Exiles Start With A Sunpebble

Post by noivad » Mon Feb 09, 2009 5:47 pm

Maeght wrote:
noivad wrote: This isn't a basic game mechanic. Adding SS channels outside the 4 in game would be a basic change. Or changing swing regeneration rate proportionally to match balance total would be one. This is like a sliver of a change in communication ability. It's nothing new, nor is it a fundamental change in the game itself.
.
Do you understand that the game has social mechanics designed in? The sunstone has historically been a milestone for a character, often recognized when the character tests the sunstone for transmission the first time.

It is analogous to building a house in frontier times. You can do it alone, but often the community will help. Once you have it, you're part of the community.

Handing them a listen only device does not make them part of the community. It does not let them participate. "Is anyone with lowbie A?" Lowbie B is and dealing with the situation, but can't answer.
It's still not a basic game mechanic. Maybe if you rephrase that to "basic social achievement" I'd be more on board. Still do not agree with you though.

Oh and Lowbie B could toggle the sender of the general SS and the sender, if they were semi-intelligent would figure it out. Thus interaction is born! :)
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Re: Have Fresh Off Boat Exiles Start With A Sunpebble

Post by Maeght » Mon Feb 09, 2009 5:52 pm

Gremlins wrote: I guess I forgot to put a smiley… I could do like someone else and link to some wikipedia article (and yes It wasn't you or FT). The idea there was that you actually used the fact that it was that way for years (like the free lib) to actually oppose to a change that seems reasonable (to me at least). But sure, if nothing can change… Lets remove all the trainers that were implemented after the 3 that existed first (if my memory serves me well for the number). The Agratis demo works well too (after all, it has been working for 10 years). The storage works well. No reason to change it , it has also been working for bloody ages…
Nobody said nothing can change. And yet again I remind you that I am not advocating removing anything currently in the game but you keep on suggesting that I am or would agree with it.

To the best of my knowledge, just about every real noob and most of the fake ones get help with sunstones. That's a problem lately because something idiotic has happened to the price of sunstones. The problem isn't the mechanic of getting a sunstone but what ever led to the obscenely stupid price increase.

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Re: Have Fresh Off Boat Exiles Start With A Sunpebble

Post by Maeght » Mon Feb 09, 2009 5:59 pm

noivad wrote: It's still not a basic game mechanic. Maybe if you rephrase that to "basic social achievement" I'd be more on board. Still do not agree with you though.
Clan Lord is a social game. The sunstone has been a social milestone for the better part of 10 years. It is a mechanic.
noivad wrote: Oh and Lowbie B could toggle the sender of the general SS and the sender, if they were semi-intelligent would figure it out. Thus interaction is born! :)
Toggle generally means come or "need help". My example was to suggest that the lowbie didn't need someone to come. Even very experienced exiles screw up toggle talk and there are 2 or 3 dialects.

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