v1042 discussion

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Killian
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Re: v1042 discussion

Post by Killian » Fri Nov 17, 2017 4:39 pm

Jazz wrote:
Fri Nov 17, 2017 2:57 pm
Yappy wrote:
Fri Nov 17, 2017 2:15 pm
But that's the story behind the account portal.
Thanks Yappy! Personally, it would make much more sense to "modernize" the payments than try to fix oscommerce/MySQL/PHP stuff. That sounds yucky. I haven't touched custom ecommerce with MySQL/PHP for like 10 years. Square/Paypal/Venmo/Patreon etc. etc. All very easy to setup and use. Whatever GM that was used to manipulating accounts after a payment was received (or a new GM) would still have to do that, but the money part would be worlds easier to deal with.

Let us know what JOE says! We gotta save this sinking ship! It can be done free/cheap I'm sure! ;)
+1 Easy is better. The faster we get something going to accept cash in some way the better. I just hope Joe says "Do It!". I'm worried tho. We haven't seen Joe in ages. If this is the end and the GM's know it, they need to start the party now so we can....well, party!
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Re: v1042 discussion

Post by meph » Fri Nov 17, 2017 4:43 pm

Daimoth wrote:
Fri Nov 17, 2017 7:51 am
I want to make it work out. Tell me how, baby.
pay my billz, big boi

This news is unfortunate. I will withhold any further comments/suggestions until Joe has made his position on the matter crystal clear.


-Actual Mephisto
"I don't do drugs. I am drugs." - Salvador Dali

Killian
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Re: v1042 discussion

Post by Killian » Fri Nov 17, 2017 5:18 pm

Gm's, I love you all. You know this if you have seen my /pray's. But I'm getting the feeling something/info is being withheld.
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Ann
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Re: v1042 discussion

Post by Ann » Fri Nov 17, 2017 5:27 pm

Killian wrote:
Thu Nov 16, 2017 2:51 pm
Ann wrote:
Wed Nov 15, 2017 9:13 pm
Money for the hosting service isn't likely to be a problem. It's not that expensive. Likewise, as Adar says, the images and music are finally starting to qualify as retro. :)

I haven't been more than a fly on the wall in Clan Lord development for 10 years now, but as I understand it, the main issues are the Account Portal, clients, and world-building apps. Way back when, a couple of people were actually being paid to work on Clan Lord -- it was my full-time job for 6 years -- and were responsible for most of the boring stuff in addition to many wonderfully fun parts. But it's been all-volunteer for a long time now, and porting a ton of ancient software is not the kind of fun work it's reasonable to expect volunteers to do.

I have talked with Joe fairly recently, though not about this topic. I'll certainly get in touch with him.

Ann
Can we charge to play again and rehire you and Another GM to work on this? Part time I'm sure. Would that help matters at all? Find you a partner that can actually help you with what you need? Not sure pay would be great but You have to make something.
Well, I have a full-time job, and two kids now as well. I don't think I could fit rewriting CL into my week with anything like the time commitment that it needs. :/

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Ann
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Re: v1042 discussion

Post by Ann » Fri Nov 17, 2017 5:30 pm

Connie Crete wrote:
Thu Nov 16, 2017 4:09 pm
Ber!

Bummer. Ifn ya kin, give us notice. Other'n that we'll be doin our regular moseys till tha lights go out.

Ber!

Connie
If the game will be shutting down, we'll give as much notice as we can -- months, if possible. The goal of starting this discussion now is to see if anyone has any workable ideas for keeping it going.

Ann

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Ann
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Re: v1042 discussion

Post by Ann » Fri Nov 17, 2017 5:33 pm

Jazz wrote:
Fri Nov 17, 2017 12:10 pm
Arindal Client? Better, worse... the same? Accessible for updates??
Arindal used the same client, so there's no help to be found there.

Ann

Killian
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Re: v1042 discussion

Post by Killian » Fri Nov 17, 2017 6:42 pm

Ann wrote:
Fri Nov 17, 2017 5:27 pm
Killian wrote:
Thu Nov 16, 2017 2:51 pm
Ann wrote:
Wed Nov 15, 2017 9:13 pm
Money for the hosting service isn't likely to be a problem. It's not that expensive. Likewise, as Adar says, the images and music are finally starting to qualify as retro. :)

I haven't been more than a fly on the wall in Clan Lord development for 10 years now, but as I understand it, the main issues are the Account Portal, clients, and world-building apps. Way back when, a couple of people were actually being paid to work on Clan Lord -- it was my full-time job for 6 years -- and were responsible for most of the boring stuff in addition to many wonderfully fun parts. But it's been all-volunteer for a long time now, and porting a ton of ancient software is not the kind of fun work it's reasonable to expect volunteers to do.

I have talked with Joe fairly recently, though not about this topic. I'll certainly get in touch with him.

Ann
Can we charge to play again and rehire you and Another GM to work on this? Part time I'm sure. Would that help matters at all? Find you a partner that can actually help you with what you need? Not sure pay would be great but You have to make something.
Well, I have a full-time job, and two kids now as well. I don't think I could fit rewriting CL into my week with anything like the time commitment that it needs. :/
That is something I can understand and respect. Family is always first. Always always always!
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Killian
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Re: v1042 discussion

Post by Killian » Fri Nov 17, 2017 6:46 pm

Ann, I have no idea what to do. I do Not want CL to go away But I have no power to stop it. My heart tells me to love you all and I do, but i'm pretty upset about it....All I have is money with no portal to send it to.
If I can help you in any way. Please ask.

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Re: v1042 discussion

Post by Fogtripper » Fri Nov 17, 2017 8:37 pm

The number of obcenely creative players and talented coder types that have played the game and offered to help in the past is what upsets me a bit about this. Joe had a vision at first, but the players are what made it such a wonderful community.
That said, Joe needs to decide to allow someone else to take the reins. Otherwise the death of the community lies squarely with him.

Love the game and despite differences, I loved playing with you all.

Joe, please either shit or allow someone else to sit on the loo.

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Re: v1042 discussion

Post by Hoggle » Fri Nov 17, 2017 8:43 pm

Ann wrote:
Fri Nov 17, 2017 5:30 pm
Connie Crete wrote:
Thu Nov 16, 2017 4:09 pm
Ber!

Bummer. Ifn ya kin, give us notice. Other'n that we'll be doin our regular moseys till tha lights go out.

Ber!

Connie
If the game will be shutting down, we'll give as much notice as we can -- months, if possible. The goal of starting this discussion now is to see if anyone has any workable ideas for keeping it going.

Ann
I think I speak for a lot of us on here when I ask, please have Joe pop into here and say something. If not, it sort of feels like this whole thread may as well have the weight of something posted in The Suggestions Box section.

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Re: v1042 discussion

Post by Hoggle » Fri Nov 17, 2017 8:45 pm

umm.. what Fogtripper said.

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Re: v1042 discussion

Post by Tara » Fri Nov 17, 2017 8:54 pm

Hi everyone, just adding my voice to the the mix, I love CL, its added so much to my life, I've watched players grow up marry have kids I've made lifelong friends lost some people I cared for, and to top it all I married Vagile ! * Vagile assures me this is a good thing *

I put my faith in the GM's to do whats right for the game, and trust fully they are working furiously behind the hamster wheel doing everything in their power to do just that

Tara * The amazing Muffin maker*

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Re: v1042 discussion

Post by Sonny_Bill » Sat Nov 18, 2017 12:03 am

Would making registration and account modification 100% free remove the ecommerce bottleneck that's currently crippling things? That or have some kind of informal market for surplus characters? Like if you login as a guest you get a message that is like 'IF YOU ARE INSANE ENOUGH TO WANNA PLAY THIS GAME THEN EMAIL ACCOUNTS@CLANLORDROCKS.COM AND WAIT A FEW DAYS... WE'LL HOOK YOU UP WITH A FREE CIRCLE 6 RANGER AND YOU CAN GET CRACKING!'

I don't know the stats but I'm guessing just about nobody has registered in recent years, but most of the existing characters are inactive. IMO if we could get a decent library of donated pocket fighters/healers, we could just give them to people if the REALLY want to register.

Then, scrap the whole payment system for EVERYTHING (just forget it even existed so that we don't have to maintain it) and setup a 'dumb' donation system through paypal. Encourage people to donate ~$10 a month, or make 1-off donations, rely on that to pay for server fees and scrap all forms of formal payment.

I respect that databases and frontends and stuff get messy over time (before retraining as a lawyer, I used to develop software for a number of multinational organisations that had shoehorned 1970's databases into ecommerce solutions... even with highly specialised contractors from the vendor helping out for $$$$$ it was still a bear trying to keep these things afloat). However, without having seen the backend/database, I picture it as being an oily 1990's v12 Jaguar of a payment/accounts system trying to successfully drive 100m up a hill using a heap of ad-hoc/busted components, when we could just ditch the Jag and walk up the bloody hill instead...

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Re: v1042 discussion

Post by Naferu » Sat Nov 18, 2017 12:54 am

Yeah, unlimited free alts. What's the worst that could happen?
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Haze
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Re: v1042 discussion

Post by Haze » Sat Nov 18, 2017 1:51 am

If you want CL to live on, crowdfund a web client, or an Electron app built on on web technologies. Maintaining OSX and Windows clients would be unreasonably expensive over time. I bet you could keep a web client under $20k from a shop in Belarus or similar. Maintaining it would be cheap and largely unnecessary. Seems like the hardest part is getting someone to lead the project. Would make sense to generate some PR around this and then see who comes out of the woodwork. "One of the first MMORPGs ever is dying after 20+ years" is a compelling story, but "one of the first MMORPGs ever is dead after 20+ years" isn't.

Ultimately, though, who cares, everything is temporary. It was a fun ride. Good luck, all.

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