CLUMP Reorganization

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Would you like to see better navigation on the CLUMP?

Yes. Finding things is difficult without a search.
6
67%
No. Everything's laid out pretty well.
0
No votes
"I don't use it" OR "I don't care"
3
33%
 
Total votes: 9

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noivad
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CLUMP Reorganization

Post by noivad » Wed Jun 20, 2007 11:35 pm

New Pages
I think that We should discuss reorganizing the CLUMP's Appendicies, and the entire first page index into a more orderly fashion. For instance the dance commands doesn't have to link off the main page, it could just as easily link off the macros page.

Make suggestions here, please don't reorganize the main page index without running it by us here or there.

Also, if you're writing something and know there's an entry pertaining to it in the CLUMP see if you can fit it in there logically instead of creating a new page -- unless the subject matter is pretty hefty, and deserves its own page. For instance Toggling deserves its own page AND it should probably be under the Basics and linked off the main page. I'd like to take all the 30-50 some pages and reorganize them and give some of them a direct link from the main page while removing others that are really subtopics. The reason being is that it's getting overwhelming to come here and see all these pages. It makes the game look overly complex, when it's not that, it's just a collection of stuff passed on orally for years. Anyway, think about it and e-mail me here, or let's we can discuss this over [http://vagilemind.com/clanlord/viewforum.php?f=19 Coffee & Donuts] at the Sentinel.

Making Links
Also, if you're writing content about, say Sunstone wear and mention that Karma has a factor, but you don't know or don't have time or energy ot link it, could you please write in ''{link}'' right after the word or phrase that needs to be linked too? I'll go through the pages and do a search for ''"{link}"'' and drop in the appropriate link. If it's an external site just write the partial url like thid ''doggies.com {link} '' and I'll come by and clean it up for you.

LINKING do it yourself Tip
A quick tip. If you know the page name you want to link just enclose it in brackets like this [[The Experience System]] and it will link up quite nicely. if you just want to link to the page but want to use a different word a pipe "|" between the page name and the word you want to show up as the link will work so you could write: "You gain more [[The Experience System|experience]] by by cross sharing fighters in your group." and it's will look like this: "You gain more experience by by cross sharing fighters in your group."

Thanks.
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Post by InuTeisei » Thu Jun 21, 2007 4:21 am

How about creating a true index page so all those conflicting appendices pages can be linked? Then you can get rid of the Appendix section on the first page. Also I think of an "index" as like what you find in a book, topic/link. The current main page is called Index and is confusing because it is really an Introduction - with a large narrative section.

Reorganization sounds good, but I would try several approaches to coming up with link pages to the content. The true index page I mentioned. A larger or more inclusive narrative introductory page, and a tag system (does mediawiki support tags?). I would also add aliased entries into the true Index. The reason you need several is because not everyone organizes information and topics in the same manner. I deal with this everyday at work, we have gigabytes of info, and still have not found the ideal solution.
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Post by Torin » Thu Jun 21, 2007 6:38 am

How many pages of content does CLUMP have? My impression is not that many, in which case linking to them all from the main page makes sense. If the number of pages is large or grows later, then some hierarchy might make sense.

I wonder whether each link on the main page needs its own section. Most of the page titles are self-explanatory, or could be with minor editing. Why not just have a list of the links below the intro so the reader doesn't have to scroll through so much?

P.S. Move the Macro section on the main page to the Macro page.
Last edited by Torin on Thu Jun 21, 2007 7:12 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by Kalypso » Thu Jun 21, 2007 7:01 am

The only thing that bothers me a little is that you click something on the index on the main page and are taken south to a teensy unuseful blurb, and then you click on what you wanted again and are taken to the good stuff.

It seems like an unnecessary extra step to me.
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Re: CLUMP Reorganization

Post by InuTeisei » Thu Jun 21, 2007 9:26 am

noivad wrote: LINKING do it yourself Tip
A quick tip. If you know the page name you want to link just enclose it in brackets like this [[The Experience System]] and it will link up quite nicely. if you just want to link to the page but want to use a different word a pipe "|" between the page name and the word you want to show up as the link will work so you could write: "You gain more [[The Experience System|experience]] by by cross sharing fighters in your group." and it's will look like this: "You gain more experience by by cross sharing fighters in your group."
Thanks.
Clarification for links:
format is:

Code: Select all

   [[linkpagename|Text that appears inline for link]]
   Example:
     [[The_Experience_System|experience]]
Also for URLs - that is pages not on the clump but elsewhere on the internet- this can be used:

Code: Select all

   [url <space> Text for url]
   Example:
     [http://vagilemind.com/clanlord/viewforum.php?f=19 Newsgroup for CLUMP]
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Post by noivad » Thu Jun 21, 2007 10:08 am

Kalypso wrote:The only thing that bothers me a little is that you click something on the index on the main page and are taken south to a teensy unuseful blurb, and then you click on what you wanted again and are taken to the good stuff.

It seems like an unnecessary extra step to me.
Yeah, there's an option to generate and index automagically from the headings. I think the solution would be to remove the heading from the pages and just inline the stuff, so the index at the top disappears and we replace it with a new hand made index, that actually indexes things. I made the index initially thinking there'd be more content in each section, and each would have a blurb repeating the first paragraph of the page, but that was too cumbersome to edit, and completely defeated the purpose of HyperText.

Torin, I think you're right, the macros section on the front page should be moved out, and the blurbs could be removed, and moved to their respective pages.
Also Torin, there's about 50 pages in the clump, a few are little one or two paragraph ones, but most are meaty. Regardless, listing everyone on the front page could be cumbersome and confusing to new visitors, UNLESS there was a good index made. Speaking of indexing....

Inu, since you deal with it all day...

Actually this goes out out everyone. If you want to help, sit down and make an index of these pages

I just counted and there's currently 61 pages. So, all 61 on the front would not be advisable. So, here's what we'll do: Make a new page for the new Indecies, and make an index (don't worry about links), and title it with your name or the angle you're coming from. Everybody gets an index section, and if your's differs only a bit, just copy the section with a few lines above and below, and put, "based on X's index". We'll take the best from each one and meld it into the front page and at the same time create an alternate way of looking at things.

If no one tackles this then I have a project for the weekend after next.
http://www.clanlord.net/
Org Du Lac's bestiary: http://bestiary.clanlord.net/index.html
Gil Galad’s Pirates http://pirates.clanlord.net/ & Ranger Studies: http://studies.clanlord.net/
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Post by InuTeisei » Thu Jun 21, 2007 10:23 am

noivad wrote:
Kalypso wrote:The only thing that bothers me a little is that you click something on the index on the main page and are taken south to a teensy unuseful blurb, and then you click on what you wanted again and are taken to the good stuff.

It seems like an unnecessary extra step to me.
Yeah, there's an option to generate and index automagically from the headings. I think the solution would be to remove the heading from the pages and just inline the stuff, so the index at the top disappears and we replace it with a new hand made index,
See recent changes and main page-talk, you'll see it already done, but not linked in.
Torin, I think you're right, the macros section on the front page should be moved out, and the blurbs could be removed, and moved to their respective pages.
Also Torin, there's about 50 pages in the clump, a few are little one or two paragraph ones, but most are meaty. Regardless, listing everyone on the front page could be cumbersome and confusing to new visitors, UNLESS there was a good index made. Speaking of indexing....

Inu, since you deal with it all day...
All suggested, already done (copied content, did not move). See recent changes or just go here:
https://www.noivad.net/clump/index.php/Index
or https://www.noivad.net/clump/index.php/ ... ing_Macros
or https://www.noivad.net/clump/index.php/Macros
or https://www.noivad.net/clump/index.php/Passed_Away
or https://www.noivad.net/clump/index.php/Talk:Index
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Post by Lorikeet » Thu Jun 21, 2007 12:17 pm

Okay now I'm totally lost. The new index that Inu has done is an alphabetical listing that works great for looking things up that way, but what's going to happen with the current "index"? I thought Torin's Main Page Mockup did a better job of listing what's there for people who aren't looking for something in particular. You don't have to call it an "index" you can call it "topics" or something instead, but I think it makes sense.

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Post by noivad » Thu Jun 21, 2007 12:23 pm

Oops! I meant Table of Contents, not an Index, but an Index was needed as well, so thanks Inu.
http://www.clanlord.net/
Org Du Lac's bestiary: http://bestiary.clanlord.net/index.html
Gil Galad’s Pirates http://pirates.clanlord.net/ & Ranger Studies: http://studies.clanlord.net/
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Post by InuTeisei » Thu Jun 21, 2007 1:57 pm

Lorikeet wrote:Okay now I'm totally lost. The new index that Inu has done is an alphabetical listing that works great for looking things up that way, but what's going to happen with the current "index"? I thought Torin's Main Page Mockup did a better job of listing what's there for people who aren't looking for something in particular. You don't have to call it an "index" you can call it "topics" or something instead, but I think it makes sense.
noivad wrote:Oops! I meant Table of Contents, not an Index, but an Index was needed as well, so thanks Inu.
Ya I never intended for the Index I populated to replace the current front page, but to be a link from that page. I thought the front page should be called Introduction. Better yet, would be to link the new Index in the sidebar so it is accessible from all pages. I think it can be done via a template change or add the link via the control panel (not sure how media wiki works).

This index is like a book's index, it belongs at the 'back' of the book, not the front. I like Torin's mockup. One caution, I am not sure if all the narrative that is removed from the mockup has been copied over to a respective topic page. This needs to be checked before the change is made. I am done for today, so can someone else please check this.

I need to go pickup my cables, so I can play with my new bedroom entertainment system - HDTV, DVD (upconverting), speakers.... My some of you have dirty minds!!
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Post by noivad » Thu Jun 21, 2007 2:06 pm

Everyone's talkng about Torin's mockup... Um, what mockup?

Nevermind. (for some reason it wasn't showing up in my recent pages link.)
http://www.clanlord.net/
Org Du Lac's bestiary: http://bestiary.clanlord.net/index.html
Gil Galad’s Pirates http://pirates.clanlord.net/ & Ranger Studies: http://studies.clanlord.net/
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Post by InuTeisei » Fri Jun 22, 2007 9:01 am

I went ahead and linked in the "real" index to the main page - book style index. Once the section it is in is renamed, then I will change the link to simply index. See main page:talk for my recommendation.

As I was compiling the index, I went ahead and added links to pages that don't yet exist. I think we are missing a few subjects.
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Post by noivad » Mon Jun 25, 2007 11:00 am

go ahead and change the page. I added links to main page subtopics too.
http://www.clanlord.net/
Org Du Lac's bestiary: http://bestiary.clanlord.net/index.html
Gil Galad’s Pirates http://pirates.clanlord.net/ & Ranger Studies: http://studies.clanlord.net/
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Post by InuTeisei » Tue Jun 26, 2007 11:54 am

noivad wrote:go ahead and change the page. I added links to main page subtopics too.
Done.

The main URL will jump you to the new and improved Main Page thanks to Torin and all.

https://www.noivad.net/clump
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